Re: initdb createuser commands

Sorry, just to clarify, b "worst" I don't mean functionality, I mean
the way the commands are named and organised.

On 31 October 2016 at 13:07, Samuel Williams
<space(dot)ship(dot)traveller(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> Mike, I agree with "the postgres way of doing things". I'm suggesting that
>
>> these commands are sufficiently generic that they might clash
> with other commands.
>
>> It's also not obvious they are part of postgresql.
>
>> Wouldn't it make more sense to make them subcommand, of, say, a top
> level pga (postgres admin) command, a bit like how `mysqladmin` works
>
> and finally
>
>> the naming of these commands seems overly generic
> and for a new user it's hard to know what commands are available since
> there is no common prefix (e.g. pg_<tab>) for these commands
>
> Just because things are working how they currently are doesn't mean
> they can't be improved.
>
>> If someone isn’t skilled in sql, the requests you’ve made won’t assist them at all.
>
> This isn't just about someone who is or isn't skilled. I work with
> MySQL, CouchDB, Redis, and various other technologies. Out of those
> three, I'd say that Postgres has the worst and most inconsistently
> named command line tools. It's a large overhead for day to day
> operation to deal with inconsistency at any level.
>
> It's not a particularly hard problem to fix and thus I think it's
> worthy of some attention.
>
> On 31 October 2016 at 12:51, Mike Sofen <msofen(at)runbox(dot)com> wrote:
>> From: Samuel Williams Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2016 3:42 PM
>> As a community I'd think that having feedback from a new user would be
>> valuable since as you say, sometimes when you get ingrained into the "way of
>> doing things" that you don't see how they could be improved or different.
>>
>> Samuel
>>
>> ------------------------
>>
>> I’d take a different tack. I spent 20 years with SQL Server and easily
>> (almost gleefully) hopped over to Postgres and especially pgplsql and
>> PgAdmin III, from using SqlServer Management Studio (SSMS – their
>> admin/coding app).
>>
>>
>>
>> Sure, I had to learn the PG way of doing things, but really, it was a
>> no-brainer. I had to spend a few extra cycles learning the PG best
>> practices and particular way of doing things but it was trivial…google and
>> done. The vast community has created massive amounts of examples for nearly
>> everything imaginable – and some things I would never have imagined anyone
>> would try to do – such that I don’t have to Lewis and Clark it but just dive
>> right in and write code.
>>
>>
>>
>> IMO, nothing major needs changing in the language or command syntax – it’s
>> logical and easy for anyone skilled in sql. If someone isn’t skilled in
>> sql, the requests you’ve made won’t assist them at all.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike Sofen (Synthetic Genomics)