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Re: Should PostgreSQL Europe organisation settle down in France ?

From: Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
To: Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de>
Cc: pgeu-general(at)postgresql(dot)org
Subject: Re: Should PostgreSQL Europe organisation settle down in France ?
Date: 2007-09-15 22:23:19
Message-ID: 46EC5B57.3060603@hagander.net (view raw or flat)
Thread:
Lists: pgeu-general
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum wrote:
> Hei Damien, hei all,
> 
> On Sat, Sep 15, 2007 at 02:24:21AM +0200, damien clochard wrote:
>> Over the last few days, I've met almost every "key members"  of the 
>> PostgreSQLFr association and asked if they would be OK to transform the 
>> association into an European purpose one.
> 
> i would like to say thank you for all the work you have already done!

Yeah, I'll second that one.


>> Furthermore some of the member of the french "crew" are OK to provide help to 
>> create an European non-profit association under the french law. As i said 
>> previously it's a very common thing in France and i think this could be done 
>> within a few months.
> 
> Ok, so since we cannot work against you we should work with you ;-)
> As you told us most of the .fr ppl would not give up your own 
> association but they have no problem with creating a new one, we should 
> discuss this idea.

Absolutely.


> In contrary, i will use this mail and state the situation in germany:
> For founding an association in Germany you need 7 people (all to be of 
> age) and a bylaw. Simple said, thats all.
> But this bylaw will be checked (and maybe refused) by a court. One of 
> the BSD groups in germany founded an association last/this year and they 
> fought a long time only for the right to have meetings on IRC and 
> invitations by mail. And there are other problems too. So german courts 
> doesn't seem better than french law ;-)
> 
> If one of the other EU countries has more relaxed laws, that would be of 
> course an opinion. Any suggestions here?

One important thing is IMHO to pick a country which has a lot of
community people in it. That means France, Germany, possibly Italy,
possibly UK.

There is one very strong argument for doing it in France - we have
several people who have already done it in that environment. They know
what it takes, and how to do it. That's a very good experience, that
we'd be wise to listen to and make use of.


>> Now to answer to Andreas question about the next steps, here's my point of 
>> view :
>>
>> 1/ We need to make some kind of poll to see if creating PostgreSQL Europe 
>> under the french law is OK for every one, or if there are others 
>> possibilities.
> 
> For now this seems not a problem for me.

Agreed.


>> 2/ If the "french association" proposition is accepted then we'll have to 
>> write together the legal statutes in English ( i have samples of generic 
>> statutes we can adapt to our need ). Once the statutes are written, we can 
>> translate them in every languages and propose them for acceptance. A wiki 
>> could be a good tool for all that stuff, imho.  
> 
> I can translate it into german too, the only question is if we need a 
> officially translation and/or confirmation if the translation is 
> correct.

If we have an official translation, we have to be very careful about it.
Translating legal documents isn't easy, since you want all the little
points to still be valid.


>> Any suggestions, critics or addendum to this proposition are more than 
>> welcome !
> 
> Yea, one: you said 5 month maximal time. Imho we should have the legal 
> stuff (in whichever country we will install this association) done end 
> of this year. This makes 3 month and we need 1-2 for the court stuff.

The sooner we can start, the better.. ;-)

//Magnus

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